Mark: In 2011, JCPenney’s CEO was paid $53.3 million. That’s 1,795 times more than the average worker. The LA Times called it 'obscene.' Michelle: Wow. That’s not just a pay gap, that’s a canyon. It feels like a perfect snapshot of what so many people feel is wrong with big business today—a total disconnect from the people on the ground. Mark: Exactly. But what if that's not just a random act of corporate greed, but a predictable stage in a cycle that almost every company, even the ones that start with the best intentions, falls into? Michelle: A predictable cycle? That sounds pretty bleak. Like we’re all just doomed to sell out eventually. Mark: Well, that's the central question in Dale Partridge's book, People Over Profit: Break the System, Live with Purpose, Be More Successful. And what's fascinating is that Partridge isn't some academic in an ivory tower. He's a serial entrepreneur who founded Sevenly, a massively successful social-good company that donated millions to charity. He wrote this book right before pivoting from the business world to become a pastor, so he is deeply invested in this idea of purpose. Michelle: An entrepreneur turned pastor. That definitely adds a unique layer to a business book. It’s not your typical MBA-program advice. Mark: Not at all. And today we're going to dive deep into his ideas from two perspectives. First, we'll explore that predictable, almost tragic cycle that he claims causes even the best companies to lose their way. Then, we'll uncover the seven core beliefs that act as an antidote, allowing businesses to break that cycle for good.

Michelle: Okay, so this cycle. Is it really inevitable? It sounds a bit fatalistic, like every company is on a conveyor belt to corruption. Mark: Partridge argues it's a powerful current, but not an inescapable one. He breaks it down into four distinct stages, or "Eras." And to see it in action, you don't need to look much further than one of the most iconic American companies: Ford. Michelle: Ford? I’m thinking assembly lines and the Model T. Where do they fit in? Mark: Well, they start in what Partridge calls the Honest Era. In the early 1900s, Henry Ford was revolutionary. While other factory workers were toiling 80 or 90 hours a week, he introduced the 40-hour workweek. He believed his employees needed time for family and recreation. The company was built on this foundation of valuing its people. That’s the Honest Era—mission-driven, high integrity. Michelle: Right, that’s the origin story everyone loves. The visionary founder who cares. So what happens next? Mark: Next comes the Efficient Era. For Ford, this was the mid-20th century. They perfected mass production—"Fordism"—and the focus shifted from just caring for people to also maximizing volume and efficiency. They were still making great cars like the Mustang and Thunderbird, and they valued their customers, but the engine of the company was now growth and scale. Michelle: That sounds like a natural evolution for any successful business. You get good at something, you want to do more of it. Where does it go wrong? Mark: It goes wrong when efficiency becomes the only goal. This leads to the Deceptive Era. And for Ford, this is where the story gets really dark. It’s the 1970s, and they release the Ford Pinto. Michelle: Oh, I’ve heard of the Pinto. That’s the one that… exploded, right? Mark: Pretty much. It had a fatal design flaw. The gas tank was placed in a way that even a minor rear-end collision could cause it to rupture and erupt in flames. But here’s the truly chilling part. The book highlights that Ford knew about this. They ran the numbers. An internal memo calculated that fixing the gas tank on every Pinto would cost the company $121 million. Michelle: Okay… Mark: But they also calculated the cost of just paying out potential lawsuits to the victims and their families for the burn deaths and injuries. That estimate? Just under $50 million. Michelle: Wait. Are you serious? They did a cost-benefit analysis on human lives and decided it was cheaper to let people burn? Mark: That’s what the evidence suggests. They chose the $50 million option. That, for Partridge, is the absolute definition of the Deceptive Era. Profit has so completely eclipsed people that a decision like that becomes not just possible, but logical within the company's framework. Michelle: That’s horrifying. It’s one thing to cut corners on quality, it’s another to knowingly create a death trap because it’s cheaper. Is this just a one-off, a uniquely terrible moment for one company? Mark: Partridge argues it’s a common pattern. He points to Walmart, which started with Sam Walton’s core beliefs of respecting the individual and serving customers, and became a beloved company. But after his death, the focus shifted so heavily to cost-cutting that it became infamous for its labor practices and for driving small businesses into the ground, eventually being labeled one of the most hated companies in America. It’s the same cycle. Michelle: So after this Deceptive Era, where do you go from there? You can’t just keep making exploding cars. Mark: Exactly. That leads to the final stage: the Apologetic Era. Your reputation is in tatters, customers don't trust you, and you have to publicly atone. For Ford, this came much later. In the 2000s, they started investing heavily in higher standards and quality. And in 2009, when the other auto giants were taking government bailouts, Ford made a huge public show of refusing the money, running ads about how they were going to fix their own problems and earn back America's trust. They were apologizing and trying to return to that Honest Era. Michelle: So the cycle is: start with a soul, scale it up, lose your soul to greed, and then spend a fortune trying to convince everyone you’ve found it again. Mark: You’ve nailed it. And that’s the dark, cautionary part of the book. But Partridge’s main point is that you don’t have to be trapped in this cycle. There’s an escape hatch.

Mark: And that escape hatch is built on what he calls the seven core beliefs of people-over-profit companies. These are the principles that, if truly embedded in a company’s DNA, can keep it in the Honest Era permanently. Michelle: Okay, I’m listening. After the Pinto story, I need some hope. What are these beliefs? Is it just a list of nice-sounding corporate values? Mark: It can sound that way on the surface, but the examples he gives are what make them powerful. The beliefs are: People Matter, Truth Wins, Transparency Frees, Authenticity Attracts, Quality Speaks, Generosity Returns, and Courage Sustains. Let’s just focus on a couple of the most counter-intuitive ones. For example, Generosity Returns. Michelle: That sounds nice, but in a business context, "generosity" usually means a carefully planned PR campaign or a tax-deductible donation. How can it be genuine? Mark: Partridge would argue it’s genuine when it’s unconditional and empowers your employees to be human. The classic example is from Zappos, the online shoe retailer famous for its customer service. A customer service rep was on a call with a woman who was returning shoes because her mother, for whom she’d bought them, had passed away. The call was long, and they talked about life and loss. The rep processed the return, but then, without asking for permission, sent the customer a bouquet of flowers the next day on behalf of Zappos. Michelle: Wow. That’s… not in any customer service manual. Mark: Absolutely not. And that’s the point. Zappos built a culture where an employee felt empowered to do that. The goal wasn't to get a good review or a viral tweet. The goal was to connect with a person in a moment of pain. That’s what he means by generosity. It’s not about the ROI; it’s about the humanity. The return comes in the form of fierce customer loyalty and a brand that people genuinely love. Michelle: Okay, that’s a powerful example. What’s another one? You mentioned Transparency Frees. Mark: This one is even more radical. He uses the example of Buffer, a social media management company. A few years ago, they decided to make their company radically transparent. And one of the things they did was make every single employee’s salary public. Michelle: Hold on. They published everyone’s salary? For the whole world to see? That sounds like an absolute recipe for chaos, jealousy, and resentment. How does that free anyone? Mark: That’s what you’d expect, right? But the outcome was the opposite. First, it forced them to create a clear, objective formula for salaries. Pay was based on role, experience, and location—no more backroom deals or gender pay gaps. It actually reduced internal politics and resentment. And second, it made hiring incredibly efficient. Potential candidates knew exactly what they would earn before they even applied. It built immediate trust. Michelle: Huh. So being transparent forced them to be fair, and being fair eliminated a ton of the usual workplace drama. Mark: Precisely. It freed them from the secrecy and suspicion that plagues most organizations. But this brings up a really important point of tension with this book. It’s interesting that Partridge champions principles like 'Truth Wins' and 'Authenticity Attracts,' because he himself has faced some public controversy. There were plagiarism claims against him a few years after this book was published. Michelle: Oh, wow. That’s… complicated. How do you reconcile the message with the messenger in a case like that? A book about truth from someone accused of not being truthful. Mark: And that’s a fair and necessary question for any reader. I think it highlights just how hard it is to live up to these principles 100% of the time, even for the person advocating for them. It doesn't necessarily invalidate the ideas themselves—the Ford Pinto was still a tragedy, and Zappos's generosity was still powerful—but it serves as a reminder that these aren't magic spells. They require constant, difficult, and very human effort. Michelle: That makes sense. It’s not about being perfect, but about what you’re striving for. And it also makes the final belief, Courage Sustains, feel all the more important. It takes courage to be transparent, to be generous, and it definitely takes courage to own your failures. Mark: Absolutely. He tells the story of Ray Anderson, the founder of the carpet company Interface. In the 90s, he was a captain of industry, running a massive, petroleum-guzzling company. Then he had an epiphany that his business was, in his words, "plundering the earth." He decided to transform Interface into a zero-waste, sustainable company. Everyone thought he was crazy. His board, his employees. But he had the courage to push forward, and he completely revolutionized his industry, proving that sustainability could be wildly profitable. It took immense courage to sustain that vision against years of resistance.

Michelle: So, after all this—the dark cycle of decay and these seven hopeful beliefs—is 'People Over Profit' just a nice slogan for a coffee mug, or is it a genuine, hard-nosed business strategy? Mark: I think the book’s deepest insight is that it has to be both. The cycle of decay from Honest to Deceptive isn't really about bad people suddenly becoming greedy. It's about good people operating within systems that slowly, almost invisibly, start to incentivize short-term, profit-first thinking. Michelle: So the system itself is the problem. Mark: Exactly. And that’s why the seven beliefs are so powerful. They aren't just moral guidelines. They are a systemic defense against that decay. If your company’s core operating system is built on radical transparency and authentic generosity, a decision like the Ford Pinto memo becomes not just immoral, but functionally impossible. It couldn't survive in that culture. Michelle: So building an ethical company isn't about having a mission statement hanging on the wall. It’s about embedding these beliefs into every single process, from how you hire, to how you handle customer complaints, to how you respond in a crisis. Mark: That's the ultimate takeaway. It’s about building a company where doing the right thing is the easiest and most logical path, not the hardest one. Michelle: It really makes you think about the companies you interact with every day. Maybe the first step for all of us is just to ask: which 'Era' is this company in right now? Am I buying from an Honest company, or an Apologetic one? Mark: That’s a perfect question to end on. It shifts the power right back to us. If you want to hear more discussions that challenge the way you see the world, be sure to follow our Aibrary channel. We’d love to hear your thoughts on this episode. Mark: This is Aibrary, signing off.