Alex: Hey everyone, welcome back! Let's jump right in. I think we all struggle with this: How do you actually set goals that truly excite you, feel meaningful, and really push you to grow? Michelle: You mean, like setting goals that don't just become another abandoned project gathering dust? Alex: Precisely! Today we’re going to talk about “Worthy Goals”—the kind that are Thrilling, Important, and Daunting all at once. It’s the core idea behind the book How to Begin that we’re digging into. Michelle: Alright, so this isn't just another rah-rah speech, right? Alex: Nope! It's a structured guide that helps you figure out what you genuinely desire, breaks it down into manageable steps, and teaches you how to persevere when challenges arise. Plus, it really emphasizes self-compassion and the importance of seeking support from others. Michelle: Sounds good in theory, sure. But practically speaking, how do you even know if something qualifies as a "worthy" goal in the first place? Alex: That's definitely one of the key things we're going to unpack today. First, we'll define what truly makes a goal worthy. Then, we’ll talk about preparing yourself—mentally, emotionally—so you don’t burn out halfway through. And finally, we’ll get into the practical stuff: staying accountable, building momentum, and using those support systems to turn those goals into reality. Michelle: So, it's less about wishful thinking and more about, building an actual, actionable plan. Alex: Exactly! If you've ever felt stuck, wondering why your goals never seem to stick or how to translate ambition into concrete action, this episode is definitely for you. So, let’s get started!

Alex: Okay, so, we're talking about what makes a goal truly “worthy”, right? The book offers this great framework—Thrilling, Important, and Daunting. And these aren't just fancy terms; they're really useful filters for figuring out what will keep you motivated and actually make a difference. Michelle: Right, but why these three? Couldn't we just simplify it? Like, "Fun, Feasible, and Fast"? Alex: Well, because "worthy" isn’t about what's easy or quick. It’s about what really grabs you, challenges you, and creates an impact. So let's start with “Thrilling”. A goal should light you up, make you excited to get started – or at least dream about it, even if it scares you a little. Michelle: So it’s kind of like that feeling you get watching a great movie trailer -- it’s compelling; it really pulls you in. What's a good example of "thrilling" in action? Alex: Think about Fran in Strictly Ballroom. Her goal was to dance with Scott. Seems simple, right? But what made it thrilling was her personal connection. She wasn't after fame; she wanted to prove she could break out of the box others had put her in. Remember her line? "A life lived in fear is a life half lived." Michelle: That's a bold way to look at it — chasing what scares you. But how do you tell if something inspires you enough to be "thrilling" and not just, you know, a passing fancy? Alex: That’s a great question. The book suggests thinking about times you felt truly alive — when you lost track of time, when you were totally absorbed in an activity. It’s not just about having fun; it has to resonate with who you are and what you value. Ask yourself: “Why does this matter to me, really?” Michelle: That's a deep dive! So, instead of joining a band because I binge-watched School of Rock, it has to be rooted in my genuine values? Alex: Exactly. Which leads us to the second part: “Important.” This is where you go beyond personal excitement and ask, “Who else benefits from this? How does this goal contribute to the world?” Michelle: Wait, so it has to be selfless? Can't I want a new car or finish my novel without feeling guilty? Alex: It’s not about self-sacrifice! We’re not saying your goals can't bring you personal joy. But to be truly worthwhile, they need a broader impact. Think of Jacqueline Novogratz’s philosophy—the idea of “giving more to the world than you take.” Michelle: So, like, starting a business that does more than just make money — it tries to make a real change. Like addressing food deserts instead of just opening another trendy coffee shop. Alex: Exactly. Or even personal goals can have wider benefits—becoming a better parent, mentoring others, using your skills to help your community. To figure out what’s important, ask yourself: “What bigger purpose does this goal serve? Who or what will benefit?” Michelle: Okay, thrilling checks your passion, and important checks your compass—making sure you're aimed at something meaningful. What's the last piece? Alex: The big one: “Daunting.” And this is where people tend to shy away, because it’s about pushing your limits into what the book calls the “Goldilocks Zone.” Michelle: Ah, Goldilocks—the zone where you're both burning your tongue on porridge and trying to climb Mount Everest? Alex: Pretty close! The idea is that your goal shouldn't be too easy—you’ll get bored—or too impossible—you’ll get overwhelmed. A Worthy Goal is in that sweet spot where it's challenging enough to keep you growing, but achievable enough that you can see yourself actually making progress. Michelle: And "daunting" sounds like what makes people quit. Nobody likes feeling like they might fail. Alex: True, but that's where the growth happens! Take Michael Bungay Stanier himself—he talks about how nervous he was when he started public speaking. It wasn’t easy, but the struggle led to real change. Michelle: A sweaty-palms goal? How do you know if something is “right kind” of daunting and not just setting yourself up to fail? Alex: Two key questions: “Does it push you into new territory? Does it excite you and scare you at the same time?” If you answer yes to both, you’re probably on the right track. Michelle: Right, so it’s not a goal like, “Get more Netflix recommendations tomorrow.” It’s more like learning a new language and actually using it to connect with people. It adds value and takes effort, without guaranteeing success. Alex: Absolutely. So once you've put a potential goal through those three filters—Thrilling, Important, and Daunting—it's time to test it. Michelle: You mentioned a couple of tools for doing that earlier. Let's dive into those, because this is where people—like me—might go, "Okay, great framework, but uh, now what?"

Alex: So, after figuring out what makes a goal “Worthy,” the next step is all about prepping and committing to it. You know, the book makes it clear that recognizing your Worthy Goal is just the beginning. This part really dives into the mindset and how prepared you need to be to actually make progress. Basically, it's about setting yourself up with a solid foundation – mentally, emotionally, and even strategically – before you take that first leap. Michelle: Ah, so it's like moving from the initial excitement of "This goal is amazing!" to the more practical, "Okay, how do I actually do this without burning out?" Alex: Exactly! And a huge part of that prep is figuring out how “ready” you are. And here, the book lays out what it calls the four pillars: clarity, strength, simplicity, and irresistibility. Think of it like a checklist to make sure your goal isn’t just a fleeting idea, but something sustainable enough to push through the hard work ahead. Michelle: Right, okay, let's start with clarity. Because, honestly, my "big picture ideas" tend to end up as… well, blurry pictures. Alex: Clarity is all about sharpening your focus on the goal until it feels super actionable. So instead of just saying, "I want to write a book," you get really specific. What's the book about? Who's your audience? What's the core message you want to get across? You're not just thinking about it in abstract terms, you're diving into the nitty-gritty details, creating a roadmap with every step clearly marked. Michelle: So, you’re shifting from an attitude of "I’ll figure it out as I go" to one of "Here's my detailed plan for conquering this, chapter by chapter." Got it. Got any real-world examples, though? It's easy to see how this works in theory. Alex: Okay, so let's say someone's goal is to write a novel. That's pretty broad, right? But then they start refining that vision. Maybe they decide it's going to be a mystery, set in a small coastal town, with themes of redemption and resilience. Suddenly, it all becomes much clearer. They know the genre, the setting, the emotional core. From there, they can take concrete steps like developing the characters or outlining the plot. Michelle: Okay, so it's like focusing a flashlight, so you’re illuminating the path directly in front of you. Instead of scattering light everywhere and getting blinded. Alex: Exactly! But clarity alone won't get you there. You also need “strength,” which is about grounding your motivation in something deeper than just superficial desires. This is where you ask yourself: "Why does this goal really matter to me?" If your motivation connects to your core values, it's much harder to give up when things get tough. Michelle: So it's the difference between saying, "I want to get fit because it'll look good on Instagram," versus, "I want to be healthy so I can play soccer with my kids in 15 years." The second one has more weight, right? The first… not so much. Alex: Exactly. It elevates the goal, so quitting feels harder because of that deeper connection. Let's say someone's starting a wellness business. Initially, they might say it's for financial independence. But when they dig deeper, they realize their real motivation is helping people live healthier, less stressful lives. That greater purpose gives them a much stronger resolve than just chasing money. Michelle: Right, but what happens when you lose sight of that higher purpose in the day-to-day chaos of, say, spreadsheets? Alex: That's where the third pillar, “simplicity,” comes in. It's about breaking down the process into manageable steps – getting rid of that feeling of being overwhelmed by complexity. Simplicity isn't about dumbing things down; it's about refining your approach to be efficient and inviting. The book calls it “simplicity on the other side of complexity.” Michelle: Let me guess – a real-life example would be someone trying to completely overhaul their lifestyle all at once, and then crashing because they took on too much. So instead of a full-throttle attempt, they focus on walking a few miles each day and swapping soda for water? Alex: Exactly! Simplifying doesn't make the goal less important; it creates a functional starting point. Small wins build momentum. Sticking with that health example, walking daily and swapping out two meals gives them tangible progress – not perfection, but enough to feel like they're making a difference. Michelle: Makes sense. But I imagine without the fourth pillar – the irresistibility factor – even those small steps can lose their appeal. So, how does that one work? Alex: Irresistibility is what makes the goal feel emotionally magnetic. It taps into your excitement and passion, so you're drawn forward by the sheer allure of achieving it. Think of it as the emotional fuel you need for those tough days when your purpose alone isn't enough. Michelle: So it's less like forcing myself to the gym out of guilt and more like racing there because I'm genuinely excited about how good my deadlift is getting? Alex: Definitely! A designer, for example, might want to create a product line focused on sustainability. They might be hesitant because of uncertainties, but the thought of exploring innovative designs and helping the environment makes the goal irresistible, pushing them past their doubts. Michelle: Alright, so clarity focuses the goal, strength grounds it in purpose, simplicity clears away the obstacles, and irresistibility ties it together with emotional energy. But even with these pillars in place, don't most people still have some baggage? You know, false starts, maybe even a bit of self-sabotage? Alex: That's such a good point! And the book doesn't ignore that at all. After you've focused on those readiness pillars, you're asked to reflect on the past. What's worked? What hasn't? What patterns have you noticed that have held you back? It's almost like an audit before you even get started. You're pulling lessons from both successes and failures. Michelle: Tell me there's at least one good win hidden in all those losses, right? Alex: Always! Like, someone might remember an old project where they gave up because of fear, or because they lacked the technical skills to move forward. Thinking back, they might realize that next time, they could collaborate with someone more skilled, or even get some training themselves. It's like digging through old rubble and finding diamonds. Michelle: I like that – turning past disasters into strategy. But let's not forget the small annoyances, the so-called "mosquitoes" of the process. Because I know for me, procrastination would be buzzing in my ear non-stop. Alex: Absolutely, and mosquitoes are those little distractions or habits, like constantly overthinking, checking your phone, or even perfectionism. The book really stresses the importance of identifying these energy drains and removing them, systematically. Michelle: So it's like bug spray for your brain? Alex: Exactly! So, someone who's overwhelmed by constant social media distractions might start setting aside "phone-free" blocks of time for work, or limiting notifications. Those small shifts can make a huge difference in productivity and focus over time. Michelle: Alright, so you've dealt with preparation, reflection, and all the buzz-killers. But here's the thing – what happens if your goal still feels overwhelming? How do you figure out if it's even worth pursuing anymore? Alex: Great question! This is where "rewards and consequences" come into play. It's about looking at the bigger picture: what will you get if you stick with it, and what will it cost you if you don't follow through? Let's break it into two parts: recognizing the potential gains versus the silent cost of stagnation. Michelle: Gains are the easy part, right? Like picturing that big reward at the end. Alex: Exactly. Someone thinking about making a major career change, for instance, might focus on the potential benefits – like creative fulfillment or greater independence. But they'd also need to look at the sacrifices – maybe less income to start, or losing some security. Weighing both consciously helps them commit, knowing what's ahead. Michelle: And stagnation? That sounds like the creepier side of the equation. Alex: It is. It's the hidden price of not acting – missed opportunities, a drop in confidence, or just the regret of staying in your comfort zone for too long. That quiet erosion of potential can be the thing that pushes someone toward change, when the potential gains alone aren't enough. Michelle: Spooky. But I get it – it's motivation that comes from realizing what you stand to lose by just staying put instead of chasing what you want. Alex: Exactly. And once you've balanced those rewards and consequences, you're in a much better place emotionally to move forward. But then there's one last piece to remember: self-compassion. Accept that you're going to stumble along the way, but don't let perfectionism or fear of failure stop you.

Alex: Once you're committed, the focus really shifts to practical strategies for making consistent progress. That's where these principles for progress come into play. They're not just practical tips; they're more like a mental GPS. They help you go from just putting in the effort, to creating a real ripple effect that influences others and contributes to something bigger. Michelle: Ah, so no shortcuts and definitely no resting on your laurels just because you're excited at first. It's about setting up something that keeps you moving forward, even on those days when you're thinking, "Why did I ever even start this?" Alex: Exactly. The book lays out three key principles: take small steps, remember your best self, and don't go it alone. Each one is there to deal with a different challenge that people face when they're chasing big goals. Whether it's just feeling overwhelmed, losing focus, or trying to do everything yourself. Michelle: Small steps, best self, and team work. Got it. Let's start with small steps, because that's where I think most people get stuck. It's easy to look at a huge goal and immediately think, "Yeah, no way I can do that." Alex: Right. And the book doesn't just say to break it down—it gives you actual methods. The first one is to look back at what you've already done and remind yourself that you “have” climbed mountains, or at least some pretty tough hills, before. It's about finding those blueprints in your own past. Michelle: So if you're starting to doubt yourself, you just pull up a "highlight reel" of your past wins, and get strength from that? Sounds simple, but I bet most people don't even take the time to celebrate their wins, never mind catalogue them. Alex: True, but think about it: every challenge you've overcome has left clues behind. Like, if someone is launching a new business, and they think back to a time when they led a team through some crazy situation and came out on top, they can use that experience to figure out what skills they used, how they dealt with stress, and then bring that into what they're doing now. Michelle: It's like a "greatest hits" album of your own life. Okay, once you've hyped yourself up with that, what's the next step? Alex: Experimenting with low-risk trials. The book calls it "firing bullets before cannonballs." Instead of just jumping in headfirst, you test your ideas out in smaller, safer ways, so you can get feedback and adjust as needed. Michelle: Like test driving a car before you actually buy it. Got it. Got any real-world, concrete examples to make this clearer? Alex: Sure. Think about someone who wants to launch a new product. Instead of going all-in with a big launch, they could make a prototype and test it with a small group of people. That lets them collect feedback, tweak the design, and figure out what works without blowing their entire budget, or their confidence. Michelle: Okay, but where do you draw the line between "testing" and just putting things off because you're scared to commit? It seems like people could easily get stuck in that "low-risk trial" phase forever. Alex: That's a great point. Experimenting isn't an excuse to avoid making decisions. It's about collecting enough data so you can make a leap that's actually informed. And that leads to the third method: deliberate practice. You start small, work on specific skills, and keep refining them. Michelle: So, basically, instead of waiting until you “feel” ready, you build readiness by... well, by “doing”. You know, it reminds me of those people who are terrified of public speaking, but they get better by speaking at small events, like club meetings, or toasts at weddings, until, eventually, they're killing it at big conferences. Alex: Exactly! Each step becomes a chance to fine-tune your skills and build confidence. So that, by the time the stakes are higher, you've already built a solid foundation. The key is to be intentional. Practice with a purpose, and don't just repeat the same mistakes. Michelle: Alright, small steps, that makes sense. But let's talk about this "best self" thing. Sounds noble, sure, but aren't people all just shifting, dynamic messes? How do you stay aligned with some ideal version of yourself when life keeps throwing curveballs at you? Alex: Well, the book tackles that with two things. First, there's the "This/Not That" framework. It's kind of like a cheat sheet for your best self. You take what defines you at your best, and boil it down into simple paired statements that you can use as a guide when you're making decisions. Michelle: So instead of getting stuck in perfectionist paralysis, you give yourself a clear playbook? Like, "Collaborative, “not” controlling," or "Focused, “not” scattered." Alex: Exactly. It's both aspirational and practical. Imagine someone who's going through a career change. They could use a list like, "Optimistic, not cynical," or "Curious, not complacent," as a reminder to embrace the qualities that line up with their values, especially in moments when they're doubting themselves. Michelle: And when the cynicism starts to kick in, they can just look at the list and go, "Okay, that's not who I want to be right now." Sneaky, self-imposed accountability. Alex: Exactly! And the second thing, is learning how to handle emotional highs and lows. It's inevitable you're gonna hit roadblocks or feel overwhelmed. But instead of letting that derail you, you reframe those moments as learning opportunities. Michelle: Let me guess--this is where someone has to channel their inner guru and call struggles "fascinating" instead of just screaming into the void? Alex: Pretty much. It's about training yourself to see setbacks as data, rather than as dead ends. For example, when an entrepreneur hits a setback, instead of spiraling into frustration, they adopt a mindset of curiosity, like, "Okay, what can I learn from this?" Michelle: I mean, it's still okay to scream “a little”, right? But reframing “does” sound healthier. Alright, so we've got small steps and inner alignment. What's the deal with “not” traveling alone? Alex: Well, the journey to achieving a Worthy Goal is hard enough as it is. So a strong support system isn't just a nice-to-have, it's vital. The book breaks down five archetypes of people that you're going to need: The Warrior, the Healer, the Teacher, the Visionary, and the Trickster. Michelle: Okay, let's hear about them. Let's start with the Warrior. Sounds like someone who's just ready to fight dragons for you. Alex: Pretty much. The Warrior is your defender. This is the person who keeps distractions away and makes sure that your time and energy stay protected. Think of it like a spouse who stands firm so you can focus, or a boss who shields you from unnecessary meetings. Michelle: Got it. And the Healer? What, are they just touchy-feely types who are there to hug you? Alex: Exactly. The Healer offers emotional support. Maybe it's a friend who listens without judging you after a bad day, or reminds you that you're worthy when you're feeling small. Michelle: Let me stop you there. Does everyone just naturally “have” these archetypes in their life, or do you have to actively build your "team" out? Alex: Well, some of those roles might already be filled for you, but others are going to have to be sought out intentionally. Like the Trickster. They're the one who keeps things light, and helps you laugh when everything feels like a complete mess. Michelle: So basically, my sarcastic sibling. What about the Visionary? Alex: The Visionary motivates you to aim higher. They're the big-picture thinker who reminds you of your potential and pushes you towards opportunities you might not have even thought about. Michelle: And the Teacher? Alex: They challenge you, and they offer different ways of looking at things, or practical advice that can sharpen your approach. So, a mentor, or a coach, for example. Michelle: Alright, I can see how these roles wouldn't just fill in the gaps during your journey, but they could also help you avoid burnout, you know? Alex: Exactly. And as you think about who fills these roles in your life, the book also asks you to think critically about those relationships that might be draining you, or don't align with your goals. Michelle: So you're not just building a team, you're editing the roster. Seems harsh, but is kinda necessary. Alex: Absolutely. Because in the end, no one achieves a Worthy Goal on their own.

Alex: So, that's it in a nutshell—Worthy Goals hinge on three key elements: they've got to be Thrilling, Important, and Daunting. But it doesn't end there, does it? Preparation is key – clarity of vision, inner strength, streamlined focus, and that irresistible pull. And for real progress, it's about those small steps, aligning with your best self, and having a solid support network to lean on. Michelle: It's like building a rocket, right? You need those mission-critical parts, fuel it with a real sense of purpose, and make sure you've got a ground crew ready to guide you through any turbulence. Otherwise, you'll just blast off into nothingness. Alex: Exactly. But the million-dollar question is: what's your Worthy Goal? What's that thing that truly pulls you, challenges you, and makes a real difference that extends beyond yourself? Take some time to really reflect on it, run it through those filters. And if it truly resonates, if it’s truly worthy—start. Michelle: And let’s be honest, it’s not about some flawless, Hollywood-style execution. It’s about taking that initial leap and being okay with the messy, unpredictable, but ultimately glorious process of figuring it all out as you go. Nobody starts out as an expert, right? Alex: Absolutely. So, just begin. And definitely don’t go it alone. Michelle: Because even the most skilled astronauts never launch without a strong backup team. They know they can't do it all by themselves. Alex: Perfectly put, Michelle. Until our next conversation, keep dreaming big, keep doing the work, and keep growing. Michelle: Catch you later, goal-getters!