Olivia: A recent Microsoft study found the average human attention span is now eight seconds. A goldfish is nine. Jackson: Wait, really? So a goldfish might have already tuned us out. That’s… humbling. Olivia: It’s terrifying, especially if you have something important to say. It means that just being good isn't enough anymore. You have to be captivating. Today, we're exploring the 'witchcraft' needed to fascinate an audience that has less focus than a pet store fish. Jackson: Witchcraft, I like it. Sounds a little dangerous. Is this some kind of dark art for marketing? Olivia: It’s exactly that, and it’s the core idea in the book Fascinate: How to Make Your Brand Impossible to Resist by Sally Hogshead. And before you dismiss it as just theory, Hogshead isn't an academic. By age twenty-four, she was the most award-winning copywriter in the entire United States. She was in the trenches, creating ads for brands like Nike and MINI Cooper. She knows how to grab attention. Jackson: Okay, so she’s a pro. But is this just a book for advertisers trying to sell us more stuff we don't need? Or is there something deeper here for the rest of us? Olivia: That's the perfect question. It’s much deeper. Hogshead’s core argument isn’t about being louder or flashier. It’s about a fundamental shift in how we communicate. She has this powerful mantra that runs through the whole book: "Different is better than better."

Jackson: 'Different is better than better.' That’s a great line, but it sounds a little like a catchphrase. How does that actually work in the real world? I mean, 'different' can also just mean 'weird' or 'worse.' Olivia: It can, but Hogshead argues that in our current 'goldfish economy' of attention, being slightly 'better' is almost invisible. If you’re just 10% better than your competitor, no one has the time or focus to notice. You have to be different to even get on the radar. She frames it as the 'Schoolmarm versus the Sorcerer.' Jackson: Okay, I'm intrigued. Schoolmarm versus Sorcerer. Olivia: The Schoolmarm is traditional marketing. It’s rational, informative, and a little boring. It gives you facts and figures. The Sorcerer, on the other hand, doesn't just inform; it captivates. It creates an emotional experience. And the most powerful example of this is the story of Jägermeister. Jackson: Oh, Jäger. The drink of a thousand bad decisions in college. I can't imagine anyone drinks that for the taste. Olivia: Exactly! That’s the point. By all rational metrics, Jägermeister should have failed. It tastes like a mix of black licorice and cough syrup. It’s objectively unpleasant for most people. Jackson: Understatement of the century. Olivia: So in the 1980s, an American importer named Sidney Frank gets the rights to this obscure German liqueur. It's not selling. Then he sees an article claiming it's a cult drink with opium and aphrodisiacs in it. Instead of issuing a press release to deny the rumors... he plasters copies of the article in college bars. Jackson: No way. He leaned into the bad reputation? Olivia: He didn't just lean in; he built the entire brand around it. The message became: "This drink is so potent, so mysterious, it might even be dangerous." The terrible taste actually fueled the mystique. Rumors started that it contained deer's blood. The brand never corrected them. Jackson: That is brilliant. So the fascination wasn't in the product itself, but in what choosing the product said about the person drinking it. Olivia: Precisely. Ordering a Jäger became a statement. It said, "I'm adventurous. I'm not part of the mainstream. I'm willing to take a risk." The brand stopped selling a beverage and started selling an identity. They embraced being different, not better. And in doing so, they became one of the top-selling spirits in the world. That's the sorcerer at work.

Jackson: Okay, so the Jägermeister story is a perfect example of that sorcery. But is it just one weird trick? Or is there a system to this 'witchcraft'? Olivia: There’s a system. And this is the heart of the book. Hogshead argues that fascination isn't a single quality; it's a science. She identified seven distinct 'languages' of fascination, which she calls the Fascination Advantages. Jackson: Languages? So these aren't just personality types, but actual communication styles that you can learn and use? Olivia: Exactly. They are the different ways a person or brand can be captivating. The seven are Innovation, Passion, Power, Prestige, Trust, Mystique, and Alert. Each one has its own vocabulary and triggers a different emotional response. You don't need all seven. You just need to master the one or two that are most authentic to you. Jackson: That makes sense. You can't be everything to everyone. Can you give me an example? Maybe two that are really different from each other. Olivia: Absolutely. Let's look at two that are almost polar opposites: Power and Trust. The language of Power is about control, authority, and confidence. It commands respect. Hogshead tells this incredible story about restaurants she calls the 'Sushi Dictators.' Jackson: Sushi Dictators? This sounds amazing. Olivia: These are high-end sushi bars in places like Los Angeles where the chef is famously authoritarian. There are signs that say "No California Roll." You don't get to order what you want; the chef decides for you. The waiters wear shirts that just say "Trust Me." If you use too much soy sauce or make a bad choice, the chef might yell at you. Jackson: And people pay for this? They pay to get yelled at? Olivia: They pay a premium for it! Because the chef's absolute control—his Power—signals that he is an undisputed authority. His praise is rare, so when you get it, it feels incredibly valuable. The entire experience is built around his dominance, and that fascinates people. It makes the sushi feel more authentic, more elite. Jackson: Wow. It’s like a creative bootcamp. The harshness is part of the appeal because it guarantees an elite experience. Okay, so that's Power. What's the opposite? Olivia: The opposite is Trust. The language of Trust isn't about command and control; it's about reliability, comfort, and consistency. It builds its spell slowly, over time. The perfect example isn't a brand, but a movie: It's a Wonderful Life. Jackson: The Christmas classic. I love that movie. Olivia: Well, when it was released in 1946, it was a massive box-office flop. It lost money and was considered a failure. It was forgotten for decades. Jackson: So how did it become a classic? Olivia: Through a clerical error. In 1974, its copyright wasn't renewed, so it fell into the public domain. That meant TV stations could air it for free. And they did, every single Christmas season, year after year. Through sheer repetition and familiarity, it wove itself into the fabric of the holidays. People grew to expect it, to rely on it. It didn't fascinate with a big, powerful bang. It built trust, slowly and steadily, until it became an unshakeable tradition. Jackson: That is so interesting. One is an immediate, forceful grab for attention, and the other is a slow, steady build of comfort and reliability. Two completely different paths to becoming 'impossible to resist.' It really shows that there isn't one right way to be fascinating.

Olivia: And that's where the conversation gets really complicated. Because the word 'fascinate' itself has a dark history. Hogshead opens a chapter with the story of Giles Corey. Jackson: I feel like I should know that name. Olivia: He was an 81-year-old farmer accused of witchcraft during the Salem Witch Trials in 1692. The specific crime he was charged with was 'fascination'—the power to bewitch and hold others captive with his gaze. He refused to enter a plea, so they tortured him by pressing him with heavy stones. His last words were, "More weight." Jackson: That's horrifying. So the very idea of fascination was once a capital crime. Olivia: Yes. And it brings up the ethical dimension of these ideas. Hogshead calls her system 'witchcraft' and 'black magic,' which is fun branding, but it also hints at a darker potential. Jackson: Right. And I know the book has received some mixed reviews on this front. Some critics and readers feel it can come across as more pop psychology than hard science, and they question if this is just a system for more effective manipulation. Is it just a guide to modern-day propaganda? Olivia: It's a valid critique, and the book does touch on propaganda and cults as examples of fascination gone wrong. But Hogshead’s argument is that the system is a tool, and any tool can be used for good or ill. Her core message is about authenticity. It’s not about faking a personality; it's about discovering how you naturally fascinate and becoming more of that. Jackson: To become more of who you are, not change who you are. Olivia: Exactly. And she gives a very practical tool for this, which I think is the most valuable takeaway from the entire book. She calls it the 'Brand Anthem.' The goal is to distill your unique value down to just two words: an adjective and a noun. Jackson: Two words? That's it? Olivia: That's it. The adjective describes how you are different, and the noun describes what you do best. For example, she suggests Nike's anthem could be 'Athletic Empowerment.' Southwest Airlines might be 'Friendly Practicality.' It becomes a filter for everything you do. If an action doesn't align with your anthem, you don't do it. It’s your authentic blueprint for fascination.

Jackson: That's actually a really powerful and simple tool. So, after all this—the goldfish brain, the sushi dictators, the witchcraft—what's the one big idea we should walk away with from Fascinate? Olivia: I think it's this: in a world that is constantly trying to make you a commodity, to make you compete on being just a little bit faster or cheaper, fascination is the act of reclaiming your distinction. It’s not about shouting louder; it's about understanding how you uniquely add value and then having the courage to express that consistently. The book proves that the most fascinating option wins, and the real magic is that you get to define what makes you fascinating. Jackson: I love that. It’s not about being the best in a sea of sameness, but about being the only one of your kind. So the question for everyone listening is: What's your two-word Anthem? What's your 'Adjective Noun' that makes you impossible to resist? Olivia: We'd love to hear them. Find us on our socials and share your Anthem. Let's see what this community is all about. It’s a powerful exercise. Jackson: Definitely. This has been, well, fascinating. Olivia: This is Aibrary, signing off.